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 Quadcopter/P-51

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gman4995



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PostSubject: Quadcopter/P-51   Thu Feb 13, 2014 8:38 pm

Hey all, I am looking for suggestions. I would like to buy a GAS powered P-51 but I am unsure of what brand, I would love something like the AeroWorks P-51, but I HAVE to have a "Big Beautiful Doll" Scheme on it. Any recommendations?

Also, I suddenly find myself in awe of FPV quadcopters I'm completely lost there. I was hoping to find something with a controllable/movable camera like the DJI Phanton 2 Vision, however; I DON'T want to drop $1400 on a quadcopter. I was also looking at the Walker HM Hoten, is this a good quadcopter???

PLEASE HELP!! I'm a complete NEWB!! LOL Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy lol! 
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Bad Raven

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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Fri Feb 14, 2014 4:21 am

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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Fri Feb 14, 2014 6:35 pm

Hey Bad Raven, I did visit a LHS and I was informed that Top-Flite is falls at the bottom of the list when it comes to quality. Is this true? Would it be easier to cover the plane myself, or paint over the ultracote?
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WarCowboy
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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Sat Feb 15, 2014 7:10 pm

Thats not true. I have personally owned several topflight models, with my favorites being the DR1 60 and the P6E Hawk. Every topflight model I have owned, flown and witnessed has been a fantastic model. Mostly because they are not junk and the fact they all flew very very well. Before worrying about scale, one must have a worthy flying air frame first and foremost, and TF excels at that part.

Just as a side note worthy of mention, always go larger with the engine recommendations.  For example, my DR1 called for a .60 I went with a saito .82    The P6E called for a 1.20, so I installed a satio 1.50
The reasons are simple here. Almost all models need more added nose weight to balance out the CG.
The larger engine gets that a little closer without needing as much added ballast and to boot they are able to swing a larger/wider "more scale like" prop at lower RPMs. This saves engine life and half to three quarters cruise throttle will be all you really need, which also sounds more real. But when you get into trouble, the power is there to get you out, and that is the largest benefit in my opinion!

Don't let the ARF's lack of scale skin and lines convince you that you cannot add to it, and the skys the limit with all that stuff, with only "money and time" that you can work with while you actually have a great flying model.
I will post a video to show you what I mean.
With that being said, there are super nice fiberglass models out there, and I am not going to argue the quality of those, but If you have never owned or flown a giant scale warbird of that caliber, it would be wise to go with TF to start off with for ease of flying with their forgivable traits and what you get per $.
I will leave it at that for your consideration.

Here a video of a fella weathering and adding other details right onto the monokote.



And another for a BBD P51 with scale exhaust outs.



There are more videos like this out there showing people doing all sorts of cool stuff to their ARF's scale appearance and function.
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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Mon Feb 17, 2014 1:18 am

Thanks for the replies. Is that the TF P-51 in the video?
Are the TF gear good or would you replace them, if so with what?
Any engine recommendations for the P-51?

gman4995
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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Mon Feb 17, 2014 1:24 am

In the video is that the original covering on the P-51?
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WarCowboy
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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Mon Feb 17, 2014 7:02 pm

Yes it's a giant scale topflite and yes it appears to be the original monokote scheme. But he has also weathered and dulled the covering it seems.
The best motor for the model is a toss up, as everyone has their opinions, but this model mustang calls for a 2.1-2.8 2 stroke, or a 2.5 - 4.3 gas.  
As much as I am a die hard glow/gas fan, the electrics are where its really at these days for narrow enclosed cowls.  There is no beating a moki radial in my opinion for open cowls period, but for this mustang I am really impressed with the power, reliability of an electric setup with a sound module.
Here is a video so you can see what I mean and a link to the sound modules.

>SOUND MODULE LINK<

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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Tue Feb 18, 2014 1:55 am

I did not think Moki/RCS radials would fit this plane?
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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:04 am

They wouldn't fit. I was just arguing the scale realism one can have with a radial type plane and a moki is pretty much impossible to beat other than the turbine class.
The mustang however wouldn't sound right even if one could be stuffed in there since it has a V12.
I would go with an electric and sound system if it where me.
Gas however would probably be the cheapest route of all. But if scale is what you want, then sometimes you have to pay the price to make things worth while.
The idea of an electric is also a huge piece of mind when it comes to reliability added in your scale model investment.
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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Wed Feb 19, 2014 2:51 pm

WarCowboy wrote:
They wouldn't fit. I was just arguing the scale realism one can have with a radial type plane and a moki is pretty much impossible to beat other than the turbine class.
The mustang however wouldn't sound right even if one could be stuffed in there since it has a V12.
I would go with an electric and sound system if it where me.
Gas however would probably be the cheapest route of all. But if scale is what you want, then sometimes you have to pay the price to make things worth while.
The idea of an electric is also a huge piece of mind when it comes to reliability added in your scale model investment.

I definitely want to go gas with it. Looking into engines that will fit the "Keleo Creations" scale exhaust, it appears that I have three options, O.S. GT60, DLE 55, AND DA60. Which is best?

How good are the gear on this model? Should the mains be replaced?

Any 4 bladed props that will fit this plane??

I know I am asking LOTS of questions here and I am sorry for that, but I want to make an educated decision.

Thank you all so much for your time!!! Very Happy  Very Happy  Wink  Wink 
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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:20 am

Well you named three sound choices in those engines. The DLE was not as well known for a while, but they have earned a reputation for having reliable power plants.
OS has been around for ever with the same reputation since it's beginning, and Dessert Aircraft are well know to the larger scale 3D and performance arena where dead stick situations leave splinters.
I would not hesitate to go with any of those.

As for the mains on any top flite model, they are junk. They are simple after thoughts for they knew people would just put robart or CJ retracts in them with functional oleo struts anyhow.
They are expensive but really a must have to complete the look and gain the ground stability a larger war bird should have in my opinion.
There are two options with them, one being pneumatic, and the other being the electric variant.
In the day the air pneumatic was the ticket to avoid weight of an extra servo, high voltage drain on NiCd Rx packs and because they looked stupid with 200mph function speed. ha
But now days we have some pretty cool stuff, like S-Bus servos, which you can pre-program end points and speed delay. Servos have gotten lighter, faster and way stronger, and with light Li type batteries, system drain is not a concern anymore. This all makes the robart electrics your best scale choice.
To further the function of the ground handling, you should highly consider a nice strong and fast servo for the rudder/steering setup, and top that off with an inexpensive single axis gyro.
This all but completely eliminates tail swing on and off the ground. I will never understand why you see so many nice models out there that don't have this rail like feature.

The best setup for this would be a large scale variable pitch prop set, so you could replace individual blades if you needed to. But I can't find anyone that makes a large scale version. Did find a nice 3 blade 50cc one however.
Anyhow the only other choice really for this one is a solid one piece 4 blade prop, but it runs $100 ouch

Here is a link to all thing I discussed


Robart Retracts

S-Bus

Heading Lock Gyro

Solid Prop P-51
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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:11 pm

Thanks WarCowboy!! I think I only have a couple more questions. Since the main gear are junk what about the tail gear?  Do I need the get a steerable tail gear or just a good rudder servo? What S-Bus servos would I need?
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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Fri Feb 21, 2014 12:31 am

What about making gear doors?
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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Fri Feb 21, 2014 2:07 am

Retractable tail wheel

As for the gear doors, you can make it out of a good thin stiff plastic or wood. That is one of those things that I cannot say how I would go about until I had the project underway.
I am sure if you search google for what you want to do, there has already been a forum thread on it that covers the topic with a little searching.
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Bad Raven

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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Fri Feb 21, 2014 2:49 am

gman4995 wrote:
PLEASE HELP!! I'm a complete NEWB!!

On a different but important tack here............what exactly have you flown real world model wise and what exactly have you built before?
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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Fri Feb 21, 2014 1:02 pm

Plastic Revell models. Training on phoenix now.
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Bad Raven

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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Fri Feb 21, 2014 2:53 pm

That's fine, everybody has to start somewhere, but then a large Warbird is not going to be a sensible first RC model, and flying one in Phoenix will give you NO idea of what a real world one is like or the true difficulty you will face.

Find your local club, and go along if you already have not done so and talk to them. They will probably have access to training gear you can use so you can see the difference over a Sim, valuable though they are..

BTW, I run a twice weekly after school RC club in a 1800 pupil boys school, have done since 2007, so have taught a very large number of people to race cars, fly planes and helicopters, so I do have hands on knowledge, OK?
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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Fri Feb 21, 2014 5:10 pm

Okay, thanks! I know that a warbird of that scale in not an appropriate first plane, I want to figure out how much this plane would cost.

Maybe we can fly on Phoenix??

Online name is Osprey or OspreytoOmaha.
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Bad Raven

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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Fri Feb 21, 2014 6:57 pm

It'll cost enough to make your eyes water, and if it crashes they'll water for quite a while.

I'm usually Bravedan.......... both that and Bad Raven being my name rearranged, and No, I'm not really called Van Bared................  Laughing Laughing 

What's the relative timing, I'm in the UK on GMT?
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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Sat Feb 22, 2014 2:35 pm

CST in the U.S.
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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Sat Feb 22, 2014 7:03 pm

Yes, Bad Raven is right on this gman
I did not own a scale type plane till my third one and couple years with my first two.
I was more fortunate than most and somehow never crashed my trainer, but came real close a few times. That plane turned 22 years old this past Christmas!

But if I would have gotten what I wanted back then to start with, I have a feeling I would have had splinters for sure.  Warbirds are power on planes with not a lot of room for error like a trainer has. They tend to tip stall and be a real hand full if your inexperienced.  But I like your vigor! Keep the dream of getting this plane and practice in real life with a trainer, then move up from there.

I will also tell you, its good that you like the large scale. The smaller a warbird is the harder they are to manage.
Bigger is almost always better when it comes to RC
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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Fri Mar 07, 2014 3:23 pm

Anyone ever heard of COMP ARF Models? How is the P-51?
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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Sun Mar 23, 2014 9:01 pm

Not familiar with them Gman
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gman4995



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PostSubject: Re: Quadcopter/P-51   Sun Mar 23, 2014 11:58 pm

Thanks Admin! They're supposed to be very good models, and it seems very simple to build/paint. Thank you again for responding.
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